Into The Hornet’s Nest- Gaim 44 -RX! 081


Aleph (who comes on after a while) Ammit (who leaves somewhere in the middle), and Jonathon (the anchor of this episode) discuss and review Kamen Rider Gaim 44, and some listener feedback.

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Or tweet the show @unKamenRX

Aleph @NeedsMoreAleph

Ammit @TrialOfHeroes

Jonathon @TheImposter

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12 thoughts on “Into The Hornet’s Nest- Gaim 44 -RX! 081

  1. I do thank Jonathon and Aleph for answering my stuff in the podcast. If I made either one mad, that was never my intent and I apologize if so. I simply was just pointing out what I noticed people in the fandom would say when praising Gaim and am glad you guys gave your opinions on the matter. I wish everyone here in the podcast nothing but luck especially as Drive ever approaches.

      • I wonder if the people who call Urobuchi “the most competent writer the franchise has ever had” have the wonkiest standards in all of time or collectively forgotten every Rider show ever.

        Strangely enough, this is probably the same thing people said about PMMM in relation with magical girls when it came out.

  2. I’d like to apologize for the whole ‘Not to me personally’ part (I don’t know who’s voice was the one who took a rather large amount of exception to it, since the sudden change of tone scared me into closing the tab) Not only had I been up for a long time in effort to reset my sleep schedule, so yeah, guess I did over step a line or two (I assume) but there was also a typo in the comment (I’m not sure if you figured it out from the context or It confused you, because I closed the tab) but I meant to say “considering Japan never really dealt with those things i [Removed the ‘Don’t’ ] feel like upholding it to my nation’s standards feel wrong” and to a point I feel it’s a matter of their culture, which I’m very inadequate to judge it

    • The thing is, you don’t have to judge it ~to the standard of Their Unknowable Culture~. You don’t have to wait quietly until the morals and traditions of your own cultural surroundings are spotless before you can make any notes (or even judgements!) about someone else’s creative artifacts. You view them through your own lens, of course, just like you view everything created by America, and you wont have any impact on the creative landscape of the national industry you’re discussing (Toei won’t be like “Oh better change this, those english-speaking fans from whom we earn very little didn’t like it), but that’s hardly the point! If you’re engaging with an object from another culture, you can discuss it as it appears contrasted with your home-culture, because that is how you’re experiencing it.
      It’s not high, mighty, or too big for any boots to discuss what you’re looking at from your own point of understanding, as long as you acknowledge that there’s a world of context that doesn’t apply to your perspective. Which clearly, you do. Nobody’s asking you to be the moral king of Japan — they’re just giving you their own opinions, from their own perspectives, of a property that’s visible to them.

      • Well, if i can try to do something constructive, after hearing your counter arguments during the Podcast… i think i realized why you don’t like Gaim:

        Ask yourself, When you hear the word Kamen Rider, which one comes to mind? For you guys, i’m wagering it would probably be Black or Ichigo, however, if you ask a Gaim Fan(Myself), i’d say Kuuga or Decade.

        You guys see Kamen Rider and you see Ishinomori a name probably lost most new fans (They’d probably ask “What Kamen Rider was he?”, the only reason i know of him is because i stumbled across his name when i was wandering through the KR Wikia), hell i even forgot that live action kid’s shows are supposed to have morals too (Power Rangers did, but i think we can all agree it was also very corny).

        When you hear Kamen Rider, you think of heroes of justice, while others hear That Bug themed counterpart to Power Rangers/Super Sentai that’s darker, and edgier, and ANGST, ANGST, ANGST! (Of course i’m making wild assumptions).

    • To address your comments RE: “When you hear the word Kamen Rider, which one comes to mind?”

      You would lose your wager, which is why it is good that there is no money at play. I started in on Fourze and Fourze is the Rider against whom I judge all other Riders. Fourze was my start about a year and change ago and I’ve since had the luxury to be able to mainline a whole mess of the series before and after as well as take in a couple Sentai shows as well.

      I think it’s less that I’m thinking of heroes of justice vs. angsty sentai and more that when I look at Gaim, I am constantly confused and frustrated because it seems (to me, at least) to be deliberately avoiding making a moral statement of any kind or even adhering to a central dramatic question beyond “will Kouta save the day?” while seeming to spend more time trying to appeal to that horrible part of some people (people like my own much-maligned younger self) that wants to never be questioned or asked to do a thing because it’s the pro-social thing to do because how dare anyone even imply they have an idea about how I (not people generally but the singular viewer in particular) should behave. I see these characters doing things but I have difficulty reconciling most of what they do with things they did recently. For instance, Kaito’s recent reversion to the more powermad characterization when recently we’d had a Kaito who seemed to evince some code of honour and restraint (which is why he didn’t grind Micchy into the dirt well before now). I see large amounts of time and energy being put to things (most notably Ryouma and his data-gathering) which tend to peter out or disappear without a resolution which feels commensurate with the buildup.

      With regard to the whole “morals” stance, though, I am again confused because the way I read your comment, it seems to me that you think there have been no moral statements or societal commentary or social instruction in the Kamen Rider series, recent or past. Decade was about a bad person coming to see how excellent and worthwhile it is to have friends and people you care about and to protect them, Kuuga has a lot to say/show about the ultimately destructive effect violence has on individuals as well as on society at large, Ryuki explored questions about what lies beyond merely surviving in a harsh world (social optimism/pro-sociality in Shinji followed by three shades of individualism/egotism in Ren, Kitaoka and Asukura as well as the various other Riders throughout). It is through a disciplined focus (some more than others) on these core dramatic questions and themes that these shows become more than simply series of interrelated events featuring karate bugmen and become stories which transmit or affirm values.

      But since you are commenting and we are exchanging experiences and perspectives, I will say this:

      I look for moral/philosophical perspectives and thorough examinations of themes in my media (tokusatsu, TV drama, etc.). I started watching Kamen Rider so voraciously because I’d recently become frustrated with the American superhero field because I felt a lot of it had simply become self-perpetuating but what was being perpetuated had less and less to say to me. There’s more Spider-Man because there needs to be more Spider-Man and they’ve said most of what needs to be said about Spider-Man but he’s still there (that’s the short form) and at the same time, a lot of unexamined societal ideas started making their way into the stories because they had begun to be written by people who were not interested in telling stories about people or about themselves or about their worldview and more interested in finding new complicated hoops through which Spider-Man and his ilk can jump, which is an artform itself but loses quite a bit with each new iteration, particularly once you’ve been through the cycle a few times.

      Then I saw Kamen Rider Fourze and suddenly commentary was being made on life, on how to live and on how we can look at the world; I tried some other shows and found that they all had some worldview or perspective on an aspect of life they were putting forward and I was so happy because my media was engaging with me in a way I hadn’t felt in a long time and I loved it. I may not agree with it all and I may not love it all, but at least I’ve felt that it was offering me a perspective that was more than I would have had on my own.

      That is why I watch Kamen Rider.

      Why do you watch Kamen Rider?

  3. >Replying to Claire (Because either i’m blind or the Reply button is missing)

    Uh, well no not… err, uhm… well when you put it like that i…

    I’m starting to realize that the people who told me i was bad at expressing myself were right; but its not an age thing or anything like that, Gaim popularity stems from the fact it broke the trends that a majority of the fanbase were complaining about:

    2 Episode Format
    Too Lighthearted (Or has a ‘Shunpei’)
    Needs to be more serious

    When people came to see the circus act called a ‘Fruit Rider’, they laughed and threw peanuts, but around episode Eleven they tilted their heads, slowly as the act went on the audience began clamor

    “How’d a show about Fruit Riders get Serious?!”
    “Well that was dark!”

    My theatics aside, the point is Gaim was made out what a decent amount of what the fanbase wanted, eventually the hype will fade, and will be seen for what it is, whatever that may be

    None of those are reasons i like Gaim though, i just like seeing the Gimmicks in action

    >Replying to Alephs (I’m already here so why not)

    I originally got into Kamen Rider through the Super Hero Time scenes left in at the beginning of some Gobusters episodes, i thought i could replicate the SHT feeling, but i ending up just watching Fourze, which after a while i recalled being mentioned on a podcast i used to listen too, and switch thing got me interested in seeing what other devices are used for transformation in the series

      • Yeah pretty much, it’s honestly because of the fact it broke trends and people had low exceptions of the ‘Street Dancing Fruit Samurai with the Not-Pokemon Monsters transforming with the Cutting Board Driver’

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